An RPG detailing the aftermath of the events of PoP3 and the events before PoP4
 
HomeHome  CalendarCalendar  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 A Song of Ice and Fire

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : 1, 2, 3  Next
AuthorMessage
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:10 am

Now we have a thread to keep potential spoilers out of other threads.

Since not everyone has finished all of the books, we should still keep things in spoilers and note what book the info is coming from.


As to ignoring the magic...

Book 2
Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Saeros
Voice of the Nobility
avatar

Posts : 1863
Join date : 2011-08-22
Location : Avernus

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:16 am

Yeah, but did it indeed? (I didn't read that chapter. I usually read only the cool characters first. But you can spoil it at will.).

ASOIF is a point-of-view story. Perhaps what was described as a shadow was merely a regular assassin, who Brienne/Catelyn/whatever, in panic, interpreted as a shadow.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:18 am

It was very clear that it was magic. One of the previous chapters showed how it came to be, as well. If you're a fan of the HBO series (Come on, everyone is!) that made it even less subtle, unfortunately.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Saeros
Voice of the Nobility
avatar

Posts : 1863
Join date : 2011-08-22
Location : Avernus

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:24 am

I think the best evidence for magic you can find in Westeros is the Wall itself. Sure, there are white-walkers and ressurected people. But the wall is massive!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:28 am

Oddly, I like the Wall as a level of magic. Sure, a giant wall of ice is rather... in-your-face with its mere existance, but the magic involved is more subtle and just less distracting.

There was another example that is easily ignored, and is the way I would have preferred he kept magic. I think this was book 3, but it may have been book 4. Either way, this is a true spoiler, so be warned!
Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Marcus the Shadow Fighter
Grandmaster
avatar

Posts : 1148
Join date : 2011-08-20
Location : A windy cavern somewhere near Helsinki

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:30 am

Resurrections sound absurd to me.

_________________
Grandmaster of the Shadow Legion
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:38 am

The resurrected characters are carrying out my least favorite arc in the series so far. Including magic is really unnecessary for their revenge too.


A cliff-hanger from Book 5
Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:40 am

I think the magic in asoiaf is rather subtile.

Instead of an assassin: a shadow and that 'curse' (Although I doubt if that curse had any effect)
The Dragons are, ofcourse, awesome because the Targaryens (and the Blackfyres) are awesome too Very Happy

The Dead Cat, really ruins a large part for me.. I really want to read the effect of the knights of faith (can't remember their name Sad ) and the fact that my favourite (royal) house if coming back to Westeros.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Marcus the Shadow Fighter
Grandmaster
avatar

Posts : 1148
Join date : 2011-08-20
Location : A windy cavern somewhere near Helsinki

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:45 am

Well, Pedron Niall died in the Wheel of Time series before he could fulfill his dreams of an unified world under the Whitecloak rule. (It could've even been a nice thing.)


_________________
Grandmaster of the Shadow Legion
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:53 am

I still have some faith for the revival of the political side of the Game.

Speculation from Book 5
Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 1:09 am

Ana Sulran wrote:
I still have some faith for the revival of the political side of the Game.

Speculation from Book 5
Spoiler:
 

I really hate that!

Spoiler:
 


way too far fetched if you ask me... also because lots of argument supporting it are from the Tales of Dunk&Egg. And it would be very nasty if you have to buy those short stories in order to understand what is going on in asoiaf
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 1:12 am

I didn't need any short stories to come to that conclusion.

Spoiler:
 

It is just speculation, of course. Martin could very well go a different route and I wouldn't be too surprised.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sat Aug 04, 2012 1:21 am

he had a westerosi noble woman as wife, because of Aerys. She died and then he loved a slave from Lys.

THey think this Lyseen Slave is the sister of Varys (also from Lys) and therefore a blackfyre.

Varys would be a Blackfyre because a certain red priest cut off his manhood and burned it in a ritual. (perhaps one where you'd need royal blood) I think it is far-fetched and am still waiting for the Valyrian swords of the Targaryens: Blackfyre and Dark Sister.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:59 am

House Martell... great House, or greatest House?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 1:01 am

Ana Sulran wrote:
House Martell... great House, or greatest House?

great. Love it. could be the greatest atm.

but the greatest was and will always be the Targaryens.


Last edited by Aelos on Sun Aug 05, 2012 1:55 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Marcus the Shadow Fighter
Grandmaster
avatar

Posts : 1148
Join date : 2011-08-20
Location : A windy cavern somewhere near Helsinki

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 1:54 am

It's like the Game of Houses, except that it's concentrated ONLY in the Game.

_________________
Grandmaster of the Shadow Legion
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Ser Varys
Grandmaster
avatar

Posts : 753
Join date : 2011-09-26
Location : East Coast USA

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:16 am

Aelos wrote:
Ana Sulran wrote:
House Martell... great House, or greatest House?

great. Love it. could be the greatest atm.

but the greatest was and will always be the Targaryens.

The Targaryens couldn't subdue the Martells and Dorne through warfare, they had to resort to marriage pacts. I find their words, "Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken," to be the most fitting/interesting.

_________________

Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:31 am

So the appointed steward failed.

What if Aegon the Dragonlord took Dorne as well? I am convinced he could have, though why didn't he?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:45 am

The Martells have been masters of diplomacy and true warfare.

Beating them in the field doesn't mean a thing, they always come out ahead in the end. They've gathered the principles of war in a (enlightened) Clausewitzian manner. War isn't about the military conflict, but the political struggle.


Spoilers from Book 3
Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:53 am

But isn't there more fun in fighting and shedding unnecessary blood?

The Targaryens have proven to master that discipline of war.

Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:55 am

The Targaryans had dragons. That's how they won their wars.

Had the Dragons died within the first generation, even within the first three, the dynasty would have lost control of at least a few of the Seven Kingdoms.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 4:57 am

I disagree.

The banner of war was raised by the faith, no dragon can fight that. It would involve attacking your own settlements with dragonfire and ruining your Kingdom. That is why Maeghor offered golden dragons for every dead knight.

What about the Blackfyre rebellion? The Kingdoms could have declared for themselves...
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Isabel Tenorio
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1610
Join date : 2012-06-20

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:01 am

Generations later.

The Targaryans were not always incompetent/mad as rulers. The point is, they owe their grand success at conquest to dragons, not soldiers. Once they acquired massive amounts of political capital, they survived. They didn't conquer Seven Kingdoms with faith, they did so with dragons.

They did a spectacular job of keeping themselves 'above' the lords of the former Kingdoms, which played into their legitimacy. Holding onto the throne after a rebellion here and there isn't the sign of a great dynasty.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Ser Varys
Grandmaster
avatar

Posts : 753
Join date : 2011-09-26
Location : East Coast USA

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:02 am

Aelos wrote:
So the appointed steward failed.

What if Aegon the Dragonlord took Dorne as well? I am convinced he could have, though why didn't he?

Even with his oh-so-powerful dragons, he lost thousands of troops due to guerrilla fighting in Dorne. He continued to lose troops, and never managed to have any successful victory against Dorne, so he decided to withdraw.

The Targaryens aren't that good at war without their dragons. Hence Roberts Rebellion, the Dornish Rebellion, etc.

_________________

Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sir Haegon
Knight
avatar

Posts : 1471
Join date : 2012-02-20
Location : Sarleon

PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:04 am

But they are the Targaryens!

Maeghor was the younger son of Aegon I btw.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: A Song of Ice and Fire    

Back to top Go down
 
A Song of Ice and Fire
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 3Go to page : 1, 2, 3  Next
 Similar topics
-
» A Song of Ice and Fire (SPOILERS)
» Kelsey Grammer
» NORTH AND SOUTH KOREA EXCHANGE ROCKET FIRE.
» Civil Defense MkII Fire Helmet
» AMY'S SONG WRITTEN BY HER COUSIN BEVERLEY O SULLIVAN

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Prophesy of Pendor : Aftermath :: Sarleon :: The Den of Iniquities-
Jump to: