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 Lore: Languages

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Iskar
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PostSubject: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:28 pm

We already know a bit about the Mettenheim tongue and it can easily be improvised by using dutch and western german dialects or medieval german.

The Shadow Legion and the Immortals could use some latin words, like Ave or Salve for greetings and addressing the king as Rex. I also found this helpful site with roman military commands. Using a different language for commands which the Veccavi do not understand would also give us a certain advantage.

I would also like to introduce noldori greetings and commands for the Silvermist, but we have no material on their language. I wrote to SD about that earlier but he has not responded yet. Can you give us some more information, Mordred?


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SimplePlan96
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:34 pm

I hope it doesnt Really involves the Dawn Very Happy

Unless u nid a cantonese speaker , or a malay speaker.
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Saeros
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:04 pm

I can help with that. I doing my phd in linguistics, specifically Latin. And I've learned Tolkien's Quenya a decade ago. I forgot it - but my point is that there are manuals everywhere on the internet for Quenya or Sindarin. They are very logical languages and it's really easy to make new composita to fit our needs.

I'm sure there is a website somewhere with battle commands in Quenya or Sindarin, which could then be used by the Noldor and Silvermists.

The Veccavians, being connected to Boadice, could speak Irish/Gaelic. I think that mod Rise of Taliesin has everything we need for this. Words like "castle", "army", "town", "lord", "commander" etc. can be quickly found in any Irish-English dictionary.

For some reason the Dawn and Eventide sound very Italian to me. Inquisition and etc, you know?

All in all, something as simple as using non-US English words give already a different feel. Scottish, Canadian and Australian vocabulary might fit very well.

The only thing is, I'm not sure how often I'll be at the forum during this week, so I can't guarantee help at short-term.
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Iskar
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:15 pm

Well, I had already given Quenya and Sindarin some thought, but studying the few words of noldori that appear in the game they turned out to be neither. The Noldor parties in the game sometimes say one of the following:

"Hai! Dreth ael noldor!"

"Noldor Dralerion vae savensir luith Drae."

"Ael vae bandrae?"

None of these words seems to be of tolkienian origin...

We should not exaggerate the language thing as latin, italian, dutch and german might prove problematic for non-europeans.

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Saeros
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:39 pm

Perhaps the Noldor language is a long lost branch that evolved separately. They've spent too much time among Pendorians.

In Song of Taliesin the characters shout in Irish (I guess), which I think it's awesome. Even if I have no idea of what they are talking about.
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Marcus the Shadow Fighter
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:40 pm

They are just mishmash crap.

Well, here's some quenyan commands:



á lelya! "go!"

avá! "don't!"

Sindarin:


Drego! "Flee!"

No dhínen! "Be silent!"







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MordKaiser87
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:53 pm

On my end of KotD RP, I might add in some really bad danish-germanic-watchamacallit representing the Ferdsvain/Vanskerry tongue. Though KotD are pretty cosmopolitan about recruitment, they pick up a bit of Norse when training in Valonbray.
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Mordred
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:54 pm

Sounds good. I did model the Fierdsvain merchant council on the Hanseatic League if you need inspiration.
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Iskar
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:57 pm

You mean they say "goddag" before burning me? Wink

As SD was already very anxious to uncouple his Noldor and Sindari from the tolkienian origin of their names I do not think their language will be based on Tolkien's languages.

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Marcus the Shadow Fighter
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:06 am

It will then be interesting to create a completely new language. Just know, that i won't appreciate a language without any backing to the "real" world, the work is huge to do SD, have fun :=

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MordKaiser87
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:08 am

VERY NICE!! Mordred, as a history buff I like your style.

@Iskar yeah maybe. I think we're very utilitarian about the whole heresy thing; so we'd say say hello and give a nice speech while you roast in Common just to make sure everyone knows why you're gonna come out well done in a couple of minutes. I was thinking that the psudo-Nordic speech be used as a form of slang amongst our Fierdsvain-trained knights and initiates. Soldier talk.
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Mordred
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:10 am

Iskar wrote:

As SD was already very anxious to uncouple his Noldor and Sindari from the tolkienian origin of their names I do not think their language will be based on Tolkien's languages.

I suspected that would be his stance, hence I have not commented on the issue. To be honest I wouldn't stress too much about their language. I know that how people speak determines a lot of their character, but I am afraid that SD does have plans for the Noldor (as I have said before) and as such we cannot detail them too much; just get his book once he's written it!

This is also why there is far less detail on the Faction-Orders (Windriders, Griffons, Lions, Valkyries... Immortals being the exception to this rule) compared with the others. Part of the reason we switched to the Amala setting in PoP4 is because it is not linked to his books, and as such I have far more creative freedom in fleshing out the factions and Orders.
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Iskar
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:12 am

That is he is truly writing a novel taking place on Pendor?

But well, we do not need so much detail, just to know how they say "Hello", "Ready your bows!", "Fire!" and so on.

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Sir Aranor
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PostSubject: Re: Lore: Languages   Sat Sep 17, 2011 8:54 am

If my order had a language, then I would like probably a nordic language, mixed with some dirty spanish from Barclay.

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